Talk:Update 5, Armies of Isengard - December 12, 2011

Marks

This is now the only (material) place that references some marks - do we break the links and then delete the old campaign mark pages or do they survive for nostalgia?

• Item:Adlan Campaign Mark
• Item:Enguilan Campaign Mark
• Item:Naillan Campaign Mark
• Item:Cannuilan Campaign Mark
• Item:Lefnuilan Campaign Mark Note: also referenced by Patch Notes - Update 4 Rise of Isengard
• Item:Eregion Mark
• Item:Odothuilan Campaign Mark
• Item:Inn of the Forsaken Mark
• Item:First Mark
• Item:Veteran's First Mark
• Item:Veteran's Second Mark
• Item:Veteran's Third Mark Note: also referenced by Patch Notes - Update 4 Rise of Isengard
• Item:Second Mark
• Item:Recruit's Mark
• Item:Esquire's Mark (actually zero references now)
• Item:Footman's Mark (actually zero references now)
• Item:Footman's Mark (actually zero references now)
• Item:Veteran Esquire's Mark (actually zero references now)
• Item:Veteran Esquire's Mark (actually zero references now)
• Item:Veteran Guardsman's Mark (actually zero references now)

Artifact (talk) 13:15, 23 December 2011 (EST)

Obsolete items

The first rule for obsolete items is to keep something on-wiki if it might still be in someone's possession because they did not barter it or even because it is still useful. This is not the case for these old marks, since they were automatically changed into the new currency with the introduction of update 5 (with the exception of Item:Veteran's Fourth Mark, which you can still barter manually in a skirmish camp). I say, kill them all and de-link the links. Items keep changing so much; if we'd keep all obsolete items on the wiki we'd have a museum bursting full of things that do not exist anymore - while our intent is to provide information as it is found in-game now. --Ravanel (talk) 13:44, 23 December 2011 (EST)

I am also generally in favor of totally axing obsolete items (and others), but there are some who strenuously disagree. Until that determination is made one way or another, the middle ground is probably to delink them where they've been updated (as you've been doing so much of, Artifact), tag them as obsolete, and otherwise try to get them out of the way as much as possible. To take it one step further, you can "nocat" items so they don't appear in extra categories, as well - example. Sethladan 14:13, 23 December 2011 (EST)

Could those who really disagree post something here then perhaps? These items don't exist anymore and it's unlikely that anyone would go looking for them (heck, I don't think anyone would remember the exact naming of them in a few months). This sort of barter currency gets changed all the time. It's not that bad to have a obsolete pages exist, but I seriously doubt if it's worth the effort. I myself certainly am too lazy to do all this for pages that are never going to be read anymore. :P --Ravanel (talk) 06:08, 24 December 2011 (EST)

One reason I could understand to keep them would be because of the obsolete tag - for each old mark it says what it was converted to, which might be useful to somebody who closed the currency consolidation popup without reading it. (I see people like this on the forums all the time - they log in confused because they don't know that changes have been made.) For a little while, some of the better-known names might be searched for, like the Great Barrows Mark. However, I'm guessing the patch notes and developer diary would be a better place for this hypothetical person to figure out what's going on. The other reason to keep obsolete pages in general is the possibility of external links: some out-of-date guide somewhere might link to the old marks. There's a lot of old information floating around, especially since this update was very recent.

Personally I'd be okay with deleting them all, if that's deemed best. -- Elinnea (talk) 10:58, 24 December 2011 (EST)

If you have a formerly non-wallet skirmish mark in your bank vault, it is not converted automatically into a mark. Only when you remove it from your vault, will it go into your wallet instead of your inventory, and the next time you log in, it will be converted from a skirmish mark to a mark. With this in mind, someone could discover a skirmish mark in their bank vault years from now! Thus, the old skirmish marks must not be removed from the wiki. RingTailCat (talk) 12:23, 25 December 2011 (EST)

This ^ -- Starbursty (talk) 12:59, 25 December 2011 (EST)

Introductory Repuation Quests

While many of the introductory reputation quests have disappeared, some remain.

The only way to reliably determine if an introductory quest has been removed from the game is to have an eligible character visit the quest giver. RingTailCat (talk) 20:02, 19 February 2012 (EST)