User talk:Mephistobl

PvMP quests

your missing info about the quests that can only be done X amount of times before it isnt available till a reset of the Keep ownership. IE the following:

• Get the troops to XYZ (can only be completed once?? and by one person on that faction side (ie: 1st creep/freep to get the quest completed locks it out for the rest).
• Oil collecting quests (can only be completed 10 times for each keep then locks out).
• Metal Ore quests (can only be completed 10 times for TA then locks out).
• Shatter Their Blades (can only be completed 10 times for TA before locking out).
• Quest:Striking Shafts only has 10 turn ins.
• Troll turn ins for the keeps may only have 10 turn ins too (got to check this)
• Lastly you can check the status of the turn ins by looking at those flags right next to the quest givers (ie for Oils in TA mouse over the flag next to him and it'll say ie: Turn ins of Oil completed 4/10))

Asurmen32 (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2012 (EDT) PS i like its easy of viewing =P

• AND the 1 time escort quests

ALSO for the quests we can use {{worth|com=30}} which shows like this 30   to replace the destiny points for all the quest rewards.

Welcome

Hi, and thanks for filling in some of the blanks. Welcome on board! -- Elinnea (talk) 09:22, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

Just another thanks for improving on the Lore-master pages and more :)

Tips: You do not need to create a talk-page to justify your edits, using the "Summary" field by the "Save page" button is enough. But do as you feel is easiest. -- Zimoon 15:32, 20 June 2012 (EDT)

Promotion

You are now promoted to Ninja, thanks for your nice submissions. -- Zimoon 15:35, 20 June 2012 (EDT)

Major revamp to the Ettenmoors coming with Riders of Rohan release

See: Talk:Ettenmoors#Major revamp to the Ettenmoors coming with Riders of Rohan release Wm Magill - Valamar - OTG/OTC (talk) 19:44, 21 July 2012 (EDT)

Question about Values

I noticed you are adding values to many warden skills. May I ask, since I have no warden and cannot check: Are these values now static? Or do they change with the level of the warden? Your edit implies the devs have changed them from being dynamic to static, is that so? Otherwise we need to revert your edits and rather tables with levels//values should be added. But as I said, I don't know ;)
-- Zimoon 08:20, 19 November 2012 (EST)

The values should not be static. Even the percentages that you see when no weapons are equipped are misleading. I haven't checked the warden in depth, but I know for champion skills the percentage breaks down as 100% plus the percentage contribution of the Physical Melee bonus, which you can see by hovering over the character's Physical Mastery value. So most of those skill values depend not only on character level, but also on what gear you have equipped. I realize it's not very informative to have a skill with value listed "..." but I prefer that to inserting values that are going to be incorrect or misleading for every character other than my own. -- Elinnea (talk) 11:09, 19 November 2012 (EST)

Thanks Elin, then we will rollback those edits right away.

Meph, if there is a known formula you may add it to those pages. Otherwise we need to use tables or whatever that makes sense. Elin's reply indicates this may be a harder nut to crack, but I have no idea. Either way, non-static values should not be presented with static numbers, neither at this Wiki or elsewhere. That said, you may still argue for your edits, we may have misunderstood something and thus we are listening. Peace! -- Zimoon 16:52, 19 November 2012 (EST)

PS: If I was too hard rollbacking, please rollback over me and edit just the bits you want to change. I noticed several edits from you in the past and you have been a solid editor this far, I really do not want to upset you in any way. We are all grateful for your updates to a class that has been needing a fair share of love for a while. DS. -- Zimoon 17:06, 19 November 2012 (EST)

You are partially correct about the static values, I plan on doing some research to correctly add the proper formula in place of any static value that I added. I also want to note that to rollback the skills would do more harm than good, as I have also been updating the skills themselves and standardizing the style of the pages themselves. Also of note, these edits are still a work in progress, if there is anything that needs to be fixed with my warden edits I would gladly change them to be satisfactory for this Wiki.-- Mephistobl (talk) 01:36, 20 November 2012 (EST)

OK. Let me rollback again then, and you walk over your most recent edits and fix those values back to ... as soon as you have a chance. I guess you have found the my-watchlist and my-contributions by now which will work just fine for tracking those ;)
-- Zimoon 03:23, 20 November 2012 (EST)

I went to check on my actual Warden, and with no weapon equipped, Precise Blow shows "123.1% of Main-hand + bonus Damage" but when I also remove my shoulders armour piece (which has Might, which contributes to Physical Mastery) it changes to "122.4% of Main-hand + bonus Damage". There are lots of contributing factors, and it's very hard to nail down all of them and be certain that you've covered everything.

But! Doing research and filling in more informative values and standardizing pages gets a big thumbs-up from me. I don't mean to be overly negative, just want to make sure you're cautious about what we really know. We can't see any of the actual code behind this game, so everything we do is by observation. That's what makes the quality of a wiki sometimes questionable - but it doesn't mean we can't have a high quality of info all the same. Thanks for helping out with the warden skills. -- Elinnea (talk) 11:04, 20 November 2012 (EST)

I noticed that after I read the comments left here and started to scrounge the LOTRO forums looking for more specific information. We might not have access to actual code but, that doesn't mean that research has not been done to exacting levels to try and figure out actual game mechanics. That brings up a question as to what level of research would I need to justify any formulas that I post? I only ask that as I do plan on being cautious as I want to uphold the quality of this wiki. - Mephistobl (talk) 15:55, 20 November 2012 (EST)

Well, that's always a tricky question. Obviously the more research and personal testing you do the better, but that can be challenging and time consuming work, and anyway we can't make an absolute rule along those lines because it would be impossible to enforce. Looking at your latest edits, I'd say that you're handling it pretty well and I'd trust your instincts and common sense. If you ever come across conflicting info or need input from a character of a different level, etc. you can always ask some of your fellow editors. I try to check what other people add, and you can check mine, and hopefully together we can get it all figured out. And then they do another class revamp and our work never ends, hehe. -- Elinnea (talk) 22:20, 20 November 2012 (EST)

Stealth attack from Seth. :) (For informative purposes only; not intended to curtail good work or guide on practice)

Skill damage/healing/etc values are something I've discussed in the past with Amphoras, EoD, and Fingolwe. From what I can tell with my incomplete research from some time ago (posts in the forums and my own tinkering in-game), there's a pretty straightforward formula for skills based on your weapon's minimum and maximum damage, your Physical/Tactical Mastery bonus (the percentage over 100) and on occasion a skill will have a base damage value different from 100%. The problem comes in with the bonus, which in most cases isn't directly observable and which seems to vary by skill and by level. Off the top of my head, there was an exception to this in that Hunter skills with an induction time for some odd reason displayed the bonus without fuss; this may be true in other cases.

I considered collecting this data, but (as you can imagine) it would be an enormous amount of work for very little benefit. To make a long story short, everyone's going to see a different number for their skill damage based on their stats, legacies, equipment, and the like, so I just went with the standard "..." and let it lie. The formula/number-crunching side of me still itches for those bonus details, though, heh. Sethladan 01:29, 21 November 2012 (EST)

Indeed a tricky question. I would say that if you have a value which you believe it rinsed of all adding factors you could use that value. I mean, if a naked warden display "246" it cannot really get any lower than that. However, does the value change with character level? Then that formula must be established, whether "level x 4" or what. (I have also played games where the scaling is not linear as in level x 4 but on logarithmic curves, then we have a numeric math problem to solve. But that is perhaps not the case here.) So...

Quote: "to what level of research(?)" -- Personally I would say that if you believe you have rinsed the value, use that value. Not many visitors (or editors) will go crazy if something errs at the 2nd decimal when having A, K, and X stacked on characters, plus 4 kinds of food'n'buffs, would they? I mean, a very close value and formula is better than none. But use ... if you are not close or if the value or formula is vague.

I notice the "... + bonus" and guess that it could equally well read "123 + bonus" if you are sure 123 is a "naked value" because "bonus" comprises everything else, whatever that could be, right? Remember that "123 + bonus" is as formula in itself, just that "bonus" is undefined. So the essence of it all is, can you obtain a rinsed and named value? If so, use it!

Detailed discussions or complex aspects could always be added to a skill's talk-page, if needed. -- Zimoon 04:12, 21 November 2012 (EST)