User talk:Starbursty

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Can you shoot me a private message with a private email? --Lotroadmin (talk) 05:47, 8 December 2013 (UTC)


Just stopped by to say "thank you" for wikifieng all those old items, also noticed you add new stuff like Frostbluff quests, npc etc.... great job!! Keep up the good work! Some advice, if you upload new icons, they should have a resolution of 32x32 pixels, add them also to their category. When using the tooltip template, you should always fill in the name of the item, like "disambigpage = Item:Glavroleth's Boon". If you use { {pagename} } it gets messed up when using the Template:Lootbox --Tiberivs 03:37, 23 December 2010 (EST)

Also is there a reason why the boxes shift to the left like Item:Blagrove's Brown while other items shift right like Item:Tirithranc? I couldn't find a reason why it does that on some items but not on the others.
Simple, when the item is on the right, it's as it should be... on the left site is wrong. I'll explain: The parameter "disambigpage" must have the EXCACT same name as the title of the page --> Title:, disambigpage: Item:Blagrove's Brown.... you notice the difference between the quote and "%27"?? That's why it goes wrong..... so disambigpage should be: Item:Blagrove's Brown... ' stands for a quote in de ascii charset (edit this page, then you'll see the difference). --Tiberivs 07:49, 23 December 2010 (EST)
Perhaps it's worth updating Boilerplate:Item and Template:Item Tooltip/doc to reflect that? As a fairly new contributor, I've probably been making this problem worse without realising and a bit more information about this could only help. Eadangar 13:42, 23 December 2010 (EST)
This isn't a new problem - I've been trying to fix these disambig pages when I find them. The quickest solution is using {{subst:PAGENAME}} in those Item Name fields, which will automatically fill that line with the info, including the %27 bit. Using {{PAGENAME}} achieves pretty much the same effect, but is usually a bad idea as it causes things to go awry when items are transcluded (mostly with the {{lootbox}} template, as Tibs mentioned). I agree that the documentation (for a lot of templates, actually) is a little outdated and it's on my mental list of things to do if no one gets to it before I. I'm also trying to learn how to write bots so we can get all those thousands of {{PAGENAME}}s fixed... And seconding Tib's cheers on all the good work going on here! :) Sethladan 14:21, 23 December 2010 (EST)

Hi Starbursty, when you're making new Item pages, could you also add the amount parameter "| amount=" from now on please. Its been added to allow quests to show item stacks properly. Amphoras (talk) 09:27, 11 June 2011 (EDT)

Done. I noticed that the items that use the Reward template is not sitting flush with asterisk. See Quest:The Final Offence. It doesn't sit flush and seems to skip a line a use a break somewhere... -- Starbursty (talk) 09:32, 11 June 2011 (EDT)
Cheers, I'll have a look and try and see what's causing the line breaks there. Amphoras (talk) 09:52, 11 June 2011 (EDT)
That should be it fixed now. If you see any more like that, let me know and I'll try and fix them too. Amphoras (talk) 10:24, 11 June 2011 (EDT)

LOTRO Store Categories Overhaul

I think the categories for the LOTRO Store is in need of an overhaul. It doesn't seem like I can place Potion of Ruindirith and other potions in the Categories section.

The Lotro store categories are categoriesed as like they are in de store it self.... I think these Items can be found below the LOTRO Store Healing & Recovery category (Category:LOTRO Store Healing & Recovery|*), no? -- Tiberivs 16:05, 26 December 2010 (EST)
I was the one that was originally working on the store, however, due to r/l issues these past few weeks, my work on the store has been nil, if you find something that is now wrong due to the changes since the last update, please feel free to change it. I want to get back into finishing the store, but life has been kind of crazy lately. Btw, the Potion you mentioned should fall under Stat,Xp & Buffs/Buffs/Resistance. If you look at the project page for the store: You will see what is completed. There are a lot of categories that are still empty. Deadmanet 05:03, 29 December 2010 (EST)

White-Coloured-Stack Icon

Do you mean like User:Sethladan/Sandbox3|this? I might be able to figure out how to get the original icon template to take a colour argument so you could just use it for everything, specifying which colour you'd like the number to appear as. Sethladan 17:27, 26 December 2010 (EST)

Hahah, okay. Should be pretty easy to do, although I'm editing via mobile at the moment, so I don't want to make any changes until I can really test what I'm doing. Does the game still use the gold numbers anywhere, or should they all be white? Also - quick tip - when you post something to a talk page, type ~~~~ (four tildes) after your message; that'll add your signature so people know who actually said what. :) I have a LOT of template cleaning up that I want to do, heh heh heh... just keep pointing out functionality that you want and maybe we could put together an "editors' wish list" or something. Sethladan 17:40, 26 December 2010 (EST)
Ah-ha. good to know there're items that do use the gold, at least. Will try to have it sorted for you as soon as I get home and let you know what the new capabilities are.
Also, noticed you're using some quick-link reference pages on your user page, good idea. Can I suggest, though, that you use the templates themselves for your reference? It seems like in the past, different editors have been using different tools, and that led to a lot of confusion regarding varying styles. What I mean is, instead of Item:Tirithranc, copy from Template:Item Tooltip/Preload - that'll give you the most up-to-date parameters to use and all that, since these things do change from time to time (especially when I think I know better than everyone else and go around walloping things with the edit hammer). Most templates should have a "preload" or "clean copy" that you can copy and paste. Sethladan 17:55, 26 December 2010 (EST)
I don't blame you - sometimes it's just easier that way. Last thing, then I'll shut up and let you get back to your good work - you might also want to check out Help:Contents and look in the yellow box for article creation tools. These stand to be improved, as well, but it's just another option if you find yourself creating lots of new pages - use what works for you! Sethladan 18:29, 26 December 2010 (EST)

Hio! Was going to work on the Icon template like you asked, but I wondered what pages/icons actually use the stack part (the number that overlays the image). I can't find a way to generate a list, so thought I'd ask if you could point out some of the pages that you'd like to see changed before I wreak havoc on the world. Sethladan 19:17, 30 December 2010 (EST)

Oi oi! Not sure if you saw my response about the icon stack template thingy. Hope it's what you were looking for. :) Sethladan 22:25, 31 January 2011 (EST)
Ack, I forgot about checking cross-platform compatibility. Sergeant Tom looks fine to me in Chrome, Opera, Firefox, and Safari, as well as on my iPad. In IE, the table covers part of the NPCBox, but only on 800x600 resolution; a LOT of pages look nightmarish on 800x600, unfortunately. Sethladan 23:08, 31 January 2011 (EST)


(Discussion moved to Template Talk:Item Tooltip#Pop-ups)

Quest to delete?

Hi Starbursty, I was wondering why the Quest:Calengad Remained was marked for deletion, which other page has the correct info? --Goingbald 02:43, 4 January 2011 (EST)

Category Tree

Hey again! Just a quick note to let you know about a neat tool you might want to use on your User Page instead of the lists of categories you have there. <categorytree>Food Icons</categorytree> will give you an expandable list of the subcategories in Category:Food Icons - might take some of the work out of updating your page with the new categories you keep adding. Thanks for all the great organization work, by the way! Sethladan 09:58, 5 January 2011 (EST)

Commas in Numbers?

Hi, Starb - I noticed the change you made to Item:Achardor's Breastplate; do you like your numbers without commas? For me, the in-game tool-tips always display commas in numbers over 1,000, so I figured that was the best way to represent them here. Thoughts? :) Sethladan 13:40, 9 January 2011 (EST)

That's a good point, actually. The only case I can think of where pages are parsed like that are with the evil tooltip pop-up of doom; have you seen any cases where things go awry because of the commas? Sethladan 14:52, 9 January 2011 (EST)
Hahah, yeah; we still gotta do something about that...eventually! :D Sethladan 15:15, 9 January 2011 (EST)


Welcome to being an Admin. Follow the link to tell you what that entails. You've done a lot and reading your discussions, a lot of people refer to you! Well done and with great power comes great responsibility... ;) Rogue 11:38, 11 January 2011 (EST)

Congrats you have been promoted to Bureaucrat! Great work so keep it up, but slow down will ya? You and Goingbald are catching up to me (and I can't have that). :P -- Rogue 23:29, 11 April 2011 (EDT)

Deleting Items

Hey-o, me again. Belated congrats on your admindom - did you know you're now the third or fourth most prolific editor on this wiki? Way to go, hahah. I noticed a couple of items that you wikified from the old tooltips and saw that some of the stats were different. Wanted to check with you to see if you were making a point to find the item in-game to confirm stats before updating them? If so, that's probably a good idea, since I guess a lot has changed since Ahrien uploaded all those images. I didn't want to delete the tooltips until I could make sure we didn't need them anymore. :) Sethladan 21:07, 22 January 2011 (EST)

Cool - I'm glad you're updating them, although it makes me kind of worry about all the items I wikified going just from the original tooltip image...sigh. Oh, well. Thanks! Sethladan 22:54, 22 January 2011 (EST)

Re: Daegmund's Gloves - I guess these don't drop in-game anymore? They don't show up in the Lorebook, either, but I just wanted to check with you before I axed 'em. Sethladan 01:43, 7 February 2011 (EST)

Was just reading this, and thought I should add a small note: if something doesn't drop anymore, it might still exist in-game. For instance, I still actively use the old crafted version of the Glowing Aureate Band of Tactics on my lore-master (which was way better than the current crafted version). So you might not want to just delete everything, but instead add that it does not drop or can be crafted anymore, and add (Old) to the title. This has been the policy for items that might still be around. Of course nobody will care about crappy things like Daegmund's Gloves, but just mentioning this for future reference. --Ravanel 07:55, 7 February 2011 (EST)
I'm fine with it if you want to undelete the items :D Starbursty 09:11, 7 February 2011 (EST)
I can't be bothered, especially since they were not correctly entered in the first place etc. ;-) It was just a note in general. --Ravanel 10:23, 7 February 2011 (EST)
Thanks for chiming in on this, Rav - I have a bad habit of wanting to delete anything that's not "necessary." In this case I agree with you about keeping things because they might be floating around somewhere, and it's always good to have a reference. My question to Starb with the Daegmund's was mostly, "Well, why'd you mark them for deletion?" I guessed that it was because they were outdated, but didn't know if there was a definitive source for that or anything. :-P Sethladan 14:44, 7 February 2011 (EST)
For the Daegmund item dilemma, I marked it for deletion because I thought that the article was named incorrectly. However, the change in naming from two named "Daegmund's Gloves" (one for light armour and one for medium armour) to "Daegmund's Cloth Gloves" and "Daegmund's Leather Gloves" told me that the item was outdated. The article was made in 08:57, 16 April 2008 by Ahrien. I figured that the Item: articles should say within the article which version of the item is from which quest instead of having two articles with the same name but different suffix of "(Light)" or "(Medium)". I haven't bookmarked one of the several articles that have done that (which I will if I see it again) but I have seen them before. For the naming convention, we are talking about two articles of items of the same name but different Armour types (ie. Item:Daegmund's Gloves (Light) and Item:Daegmund's Gloves (Medium)) unlike two articles of the same name but different article types (ie. Call of Oromë and Call of Oromë (Effect)). So the specific question here is: What to do with same name items but different Armour types?
Starting at the end - We see some of this (same name, different item) with the crafting advancement quests: Memorium Ring versus Memorium Ring (Quest). I would imagine we just have to disambiguate like we do with anything else. Regarding the Daegmund's items, it didn't occur to me to check for the cloth and leather versions (even though I saw that they had been redirected from (Light) and (Medium) to Cloth and Leather in the Lorebook, too) - lack of sleep! That said, I guess it would be appropriate to delete or redirect the two articles (and two images) you flagged to cloth and leather, since the items have most likely been updated instead of deleted outright.
Unless, of course, with Rav's point, some copies of the old versions are still floating around in Middle-Earth... Sethladan 17:59, 7 February 2011 (EST)

Ah-HAH! I just saw that you were updating the relevant quests anyway. No wonder you caught the "old" items, hahah. I'm so daft. :-P Sethladan 18:02, 7 February 2011 (EST)

Tooltip Template

Hiya, Starb! If you get a chance, take a look at Template:Item Tooltip/Preload or Boilerplate:Item - there are a couple of parameters that Template:Item Tooltip doesn't use anymore, like the colour, graphic, and questname fields. Doesn't cause any problems for them to be there, but why do more work when you don't have to?  :) Sethladan 11:09, 19 February 2011 (EST)

Removing Links?

You've been doing a lot of good work lately, but I really wonder why you're deleting links from within descriptions. I noticed in To Imlad Gelair that the entry no longer has the links like Elves of Rivendell that you'd introduced in your original revision on 2010-11-16T14:42:36. IMHO the more links the better. David 13:11, 31 March 2011 (EDT)

I personally agree with Starbursty on this one. Descriptions/Flavors should not have links. Links belong outside the infobox or the descriptions of in-game information. They belong in the headings below the infoboxes or in the walkthroughs (with the case of quests). Walkthroughs were meant to have all the extra information, including reputation or where to go. Rogue 15:22, 31 March 2011 (EDT)
There was a time when I thought more links were better, but as time went on and I saw and managed a lot of the articles, linking to everything and anything remotely linkable was more of a link spam more than anything. In the original version of the articles that I did, I was linking to everything. Now, if I came upon some of the articles I did, I clean them up. It is neater and doesn't have the blue-black-blue-black-blue-splotched look to the article. -- Starbursty 16:19, 31 March 2011 (EDT)

IRC Chat

We would love to see you in IRC chat! Go to Contributor's Corner for details on how to log in! You should be there whenever you are editing, great for getting answers to questions right away. Rogue 15:26, 31 March 2011 (EDT)

Wanted Pages

Hey you created these pages that have Requires: Participating in a Skirmish. Is that on the actual tooltip in-game??? Rogue 21:58, 3 April 2011 (EDT)

Yep. Do a skirmish and get one of the tokens. It's there. Do you want me to take a screenshot? -- Starbursty 07:45, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
Ok if that's there, could you create the page for Participating in a Skirmish? Maybe just a Category:Game Terms explanation page? Or I can. But I don't skirmish, or haven't yet in the game. :) Rogue 10:49, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
Got it. -- Starbursty 16:22, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

Icon Reuse

Hi, we're trying to reduce icons mainly in armour & weapons, but it would be good to apply to any other item having the same icon, would it be possible to have a single icon used in all skirmish tokens? I already see 40 duplicates of the same! :) --Goingbald 12:58, 9 April 2011 (EDT)

Quite possibly. There are the regular versions and the veteran versions for marks. -- Starbursty 13:25, 9 April 2011 (EDT)
Can you make a page that shows different types of icons? That way, we can easily refer to those that we can re-use. -- Starbursty 18:37, 11 April 2011 (EDT)
Reuse will be significant mostly with armour & weapons, and Rogue is putting the info in talk pages of icon categories, that's where you can look starting here. --Goingbald 01:05, 13 April 2011 (EDT)

Creature and NPC names / locations

Hey Star. The format for creatures and NPCs should be the original name for the first one found. use the {{other}} template to direct to the other places this creature or person can be found. Rogue 10:09, 28 April 2011 (EDT)

Ah, gotcha. -- Starbursty 10:11, 28 April 2011 (EDT)
One of these days we should write up the updated standards/guide for the wiki and whats changed. Thanks much. Rogue 10:13, 28 April 2011 (EDT)
Good idea. For Spring Cleaning, maybe! -- Starbursty 10:15, 28 April 2011 (EDT)
Wait a second, the purpose of those disambiguation pages were to direct people to the right mobs and NPCs. I have seen many of them point to the first place where they are found. Most of them were never corrected that was the reason why I started using the disambiguation pages in the first place: to show that there are other places where the NPC/mob exists rather than have the link immediately point to the first place it was encountered... -- Starbursty 09:39, 29 April 2011 (EDT)
Yes, however with the {{other}} template at the top of the page you have the links to the others right there. The disambig page is unnecessary. Rogue 11:02, 29 April 2011 (EDT)

Calenglad's Shield

Why did you move the old Item:Calenglad's Shield to Item:Calenglad's Shield (Warden's Shield)? It seems that both are Warden shields... And why did you change the name variable the latter item from "Calenglad's Shield" to "Calenglad's Shield (Warden's Shield)"? As far as I remember it's not called "Calenglad's Shield (Warden's Shield)". --EoD 17:21, 2 May 2011 (EDT)

Fixed. -- Starbursty 07:21, 3 May 2011 (EDT)
Looks much better now :) --EoD 12:23, 3 May 2011 (EDT)


Hey Starbursty. I noticed you made a page for Bullcroak. Do you know if they changed the name of this creature? He always used to be called Bullcroaker. --Ravanel 12:53, 13 May 2011 (EDT)

When I encountered him and made the page, he was called Bullcroak. -- Starbursty 17:54, 13 May 2011 (EDT)
That's good to know, I was just slightly confused. Will try to erase Bullcroaker from my memory. ;-) --Ravanel 06:48, 14 May 2011 (EDT)

Creature subcategories

Hi Starbursty. I was wondering wether there was a special reason you created all these subcategories under Category:Bree-land Creatures. I ask this because the creature categories used to be mixed up, some distinguishing between areas, some to places, some only to maps. It was a chaos, and therefore we agreed on sorting creatures on map only, with as only subcategories instances. Now you're doing it different again, and I wonder as to the reason. It is best to have this done the same for all creature categories: were you planning on doing it this way for all areas as well? --Ravanel 07:10, 26 May 2011 (EDT)

Yes, for all creatures as well. The creatures are distinguished for specific places which are, in turn, locations found in an area. Goes more by <specific location as dictated by the map while standing by mob/NPC>. These in turn are subcategories by area and then by map. I am mostly going by screenshots so I can't sub-categorize, say, Reniolind's Hideout Creatures. Reniolind's Hideout might be in Chetwood which is in Bree-land. This is mostly done to utilize the categorytree code. If you look at the Reniolind's Hideout and its resident Slimy Marsh-crawler, you can see that it shows up perfectly under the Mobs section of Reniolind's Hideout. The Slimy Marsh-crawler also shows up under the Category:Bree-land Creatures and the categorytree for Bree-land creatures if you code it out. -- Starbursty 07:34, 26 May 2011 (EDT)
Yes, I understand how it works. My point is, are you sure this is a good idea? In my view it creates a lot of extra unnecessary work. Which creatures live in which specific area should namely already been pointed out on that area page. Also, having pages in multiple categories within the same category is not really how categories should work. Pages should be put in the lowest category, but if you'd do it like that, we'd create a monster of a creature template. I understand how you want it to work, I'm just worried that you start this work and then at a certain point stop it, not completing Mirkwood, Enedwaith etc. Then we'd end up in the previous situation with inconsistent creature categories. Do we really have to invent the wheel again? There's so much quality (not quantity) work to be done on the wiki. Are you sure it's worth the effort? --Ravanel 07:50, 26 May 2011 (EDT)
I am sure it is worth the effort as is updating the locations. If it wasn't worth the effort, I would not have gone through the trouble of updating the locations either. If that one line of code (Category:<location> Creatures) wasn't there, then updating the locations with their respective mobs would be way too time-consuming. I know that it is better to add that one line of code to the creature than to manually add the creature to the every location individually. That is how I am using the categorytree code. And yes, if the locations were not updated like Brandywood, then there would be no reason to sub-categorize the creatures for the categorytree as used in Reniolind's Hideout. -- Starbursty 07:59, 26 May 2011 (EDT)
I see. Well, please make me happy then and do this for all creatures in-game. And drop me a line if you're going to change something important regarding creatures in the future, in order not to freak me out. ;-) --Ravanel 08:20, 26 May 2011 (EDT)
Considering that we've been down this road before and it took me A LONG TIME to get it to where it is before you changed it back to where it was before I re-categorized the creature section. This should have been discussed before hand. And it needs to be reverted back to the way it was. Your explanation doesn't fly anymore with the new extension that allows you to search multiple categories. [1]. Rogue (talk) 13:03, 3 August 2011 (EDT)
If that is what you wish, I'll revert back everything that I have done. I did this before the instant-categorization of the location line because there wasn't any. But now that the location line auto-categorizes into each area (Angmar, Lothlórien, etc.) rather than specific locations, I suppose there's no need for a double categorization. In which case, I will take out the bit in the location pages that is using categorytree to list mobs specific to that area such as the categorytree in Fanuidhol Category:Fanuidhol Creatures and a hypothetical one using Category:Angmar Creatures.
I would greatly appreciate that. Sorry for the "oh my gosh" but I just finished that project it seems like. Seeing your work go poof has that effect on you. :) Rogue (talk) 13:40, 3 August 2011 (EDT)

"Saphire" Gems

Hey Starbursty, I saw that you created "Sapphire Gem of the Stars", "Sapphire Gem of Empowerment", and "Sapphire Gem of Swift Step". Did they correct the spelling in game? Because if not, those should probably just redirect to Saphire Gem of the Stars, Saphire Gem of Empowerment, and Saphire Gem of Swift Step, since they appear that way in game. Those are listed as a reward for an earlier Book 2 quest and also linked to the relic index. I feel like they didn't change the spelling in game yet, but I could be wrong. Either way, since sapphire is spelled with two 'p's, there should probably be a redirect from the correct spelling until they fix it. Rubyctook 10:52, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

Looking back to the screenie, it does have only one "p." Yeah, I'll make the redirect. -- Starbursty 10:54, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
Hello, sorry to talk to you about something from a few months ago, but they fixed the spelling of Sapphire in-game. I'm going to do my best to fix them up and switch the redirect (i.e., switch it to go from Saphire to Sapphire). Just wanted to give you a heads up! Kadi (talk) 20:07, 12 January 2012 (EST)
No biggie! It finally comes after so long. -- Starbursty (talk) 05:24, 14 January 2012 (EST)

Esteldin Quests Category

Hi Starbursty. I noticed that you changed [[Category:Esteldin Quests]] to redirect to [[Category:Esteldín Quests]] which has been deleted. Just wondering if the Esteldin Quests one was meant to be deleted as well, or if you planning something else with it? Amphoras 18:57, 31 May 2011 (EDT)

Wasn't I just correcting the name to the correct spelling? -- Starbursty 07:24, 1 June 2011 (EDT)
I don't know. Esteldín seems to be the correct name for the settlement, but the category with that spelling was deleted, and the deletion log says "(content was: "Category:North Downs Quests {{Delete Page}}" (and the only contributor was "Starbursty"))", so I assumed you asked for it to be deleted, but you had also created a redirect to that spelling from Esteldin with a normal "i". I just wasn't sure if both were meant to be deleted, or if the Esteldín one should have stayed and the Esteldin one been deleted? Amphoras 08:18, 1 June 2011 (EDT)
Ah! I think I was going to do the quests for Esteldín at one point, but since I didn't have any characters in that level range, I figured I could do that some other time and called for the deletion of "Esteldín" instead of "Esteldin." -- Starbursty 08:23, 1 June 2011 (EDT)

slot vs. type

I noticed you're switching the jewellery 'slot' parameters to 'type'. The slot parameter was, however, meant for jewellery and pocket items. If you look at Template:Item Tooltip, under slot it says "item slot ("Finger", "Ear"...) Add only if it's used in the item tooltip ingame". I mention this mostly because I've been editing some of the items that incorrectly have that in "type" instead and moving them to "slot", and it would put us at cross-purposes to have you move them back, heh. It's possible we no longer need the slot parameter - I don't know enough about the tooltip template to say for sure, but it might be something to look into. (Oh, and are you sure that it's "Iron Setting of the Determined Mind"? The screenshot I have says "Iron Setting of Determined Mind", but it's from before the latest update, so it could be wrong now. With the previous relics before the relic revamp, they switched back and forth between something like "Iron Setting of Fleet Hand" and "Iron Setting of the Fleet Hand" more than once, so it wouldn't be surprising, lol.) Rubyctook 11:34, 2 June 2011 (EDT)

Do you guys think we need both slot and type? It's been bugging me for a while because some people use one, some the other, and then there're the category parameters, as well. For armour pieces, I've tried to put Light, Medium, or Heavy Armour in type and chest, hand, foot, etc in the slot, even though that's not how it's displayed in the game tooltip. I figured I would eventually move everything to "type" and then change the template so that "slot" wasn't displayed, but you guys are doing more item work, so you may have better ideas. Sethladan 18:15, 2 June 2011 (EDT)
No "the" on the setting. I do not think we need the slot parameter. It was needed before the revamp of items, but now it just doubles as the type parameter. -- Starbursty 18:56, 2 June 2011 (EDT)
I'll do the relics then. -- Starbursty 18:58, 2 June 2011 (EDT)
I don't think we need both slot and type, no, as long as that doesn't mess with the template. "slot" often confuses people anyway, since it sounds like it's asking for head, legs, etc. as well; it confused me when I started editing items, haha. The only thing I can think of that might be affected is items that have "Main-hand" or "Off-hand" on the tooltip. I can think of one cosmetic item that makes using "slot" necessary . . . ah yes. Bullroarer's Tankard & Long-handled Shovel. Some have been using slot to make legendary weapons display "Main-hand" (Hunter's Axe of the Third Age), which all legendary weapons display, but I am guilty of leaving it off on the crafted ones myself. There might be a way to accomodate those items w/out using slot, though - there used to be an off-hand parameter, I think, something like that? Rubyctook 20:29, 2 June 2011 (EDT)
That is true. Maybe we can just leave it on there and change the usage on the Template page. -- Starbursty 07:24, 3 June 2011 (EDT)


Hey! Do you know what the name of the questchain for Uniformity and Behind Bars is? I'm not sure if you already know, but we have a questchain parameter of the infobox quest template in order to use the same questchain list in all quest. See here for more information. --EoD (talk) 10:02, 16 July 2011 (EDT)

It didn't have a chain name. -- Starbursty (talk) 10:06, 16 July 2011 (EDT)
Ok, so I'll just use the first quest as chainname. --EoD (talk) 10:08, 16 July 2011 (EDT)

Can you please use the new layout when creating new quests? You should not create tables on questpages anymore. --EoD (talk) 14:38, 18 July 2011 (EDT)

What tables? I am not sure what you are talking about. -- Starbursty (talk) 21:40, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
Those tables which start with {|. This is a change where I cleaned up a quest and replaced the tables with questboxes. That's the new way :) --EoD (talk) 21:47, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
Okay, sounds good. -- Starbursty (talk) 21:52, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
So don't forget to use the new layout on new quests. That saves a lot of cleanup ;) --EoD (talk) 21:54, 18 July 2011 (EDT)


I reverted your change to the Template:Mirkwood page. Drownholt is an labeled area on the Mirkwood map that is visible at all times (now). All of the other landmarks are little flags that only show up when you have points of interest turned on. If it should be renamed from Drownholt to The Drownholt, it would still be an area rather than a landmark. RingTailCat (talk) 09:14, 22 July 2011 (EDT)

Sorry to meddle, just saw your rollback thingies and checked in-game. It's indeed an area, and I'd say "Drownholt" (as opposed to "The Drownholt") is correct as well, as it's called like that on the Mirkwood map.--Ravanel (talk) 09:26, 22 July 2011 (EDT)

Singular or Plural

Saw that you'd made a change to text in some places, and not in others, regarding some task quest names. One example: Quest:Task: Broken Halberd or Quest:Task: Broken Halberds.

I have no character remotely of a level to find out the name first hand, and I note that you preserved an instance where the display name was singular but the page name was plural.

I'm kinda going through with a blunt instrument on the tasks page atm, guessing that "plural" is the correct answer for the quest names, and therefore correct for the item names. Please correct me if I have guessed wrongly. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 16:43, 17 August 2011 (EDT)

The more I look at tasks, the more I see your fingerprints. I'm going to hope that I don't step on things too badly, as there seems room for a fair bit of improvement. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 17:20, 17 August 2011 (EDT)

Creature abilities

It would be great if you could add |25px to the effect icons on creature pages. That way they don't show up so big and demanding. :) --Ravanel (talk) 07:16, 14 September 2011 (EDT)

Sure thing. -- Starbursty (talk) 07:35, 14 September 2011 (EDT)

Category:Umukh-ghâr Creatures

Didn't we agree to *not* make creature categories sorted by landmarks? (See conversation above: User talk:Starbursty#Creature subcategories.) Or is this a dungeon? --Ravanel (talk) 08:17, 14 September 2011 (EDT)

Ah yes, I knew I was forgetting something. Sure why not. I'll hold off on making mobs for a while until someone else wants to do them. -- Starbursty (talk) 08:19, 14 September 2011 (EDT)
You don't have to hold off, you're doing great on creatures! It's only handy if we keep the categorization in sync. --Ravanel (talk) 08:29, 14 September 2011 (EDT)
A great place to make sure we're all on the same page is Feel free to add your name there and keep everyone up to date as to what you're doing. :) --Ravanel (talk) 09:23, 14 September 2011 (EDT)

Generic Icons for Effects

I've been busy together with Fingolwë to add generic icons for effects. This way we only need one file for multiple pages, which keeps the storage of the wiki lower and makes it easier to find files back. If would be great if you could use the generic icons instead of uploading new icons! We're not done with the project just yet, but the following pages you could already use. We tried to give every icon a logical name so that you can most times fill them in without even checking:

  • Category talk:Acid Effect Icons
  • Category talk:Armour Effect Icons
  • Category talk:Defence Effect Icons
  • Category talk:Healing Effect Icons
  • Category talk:Offence Effect Icons
  • Category talk:Shadow Effect Icons

I'll give you an update when we're done with the horrible ones, like wounds and diseases. ;) --Ravanel (talk) 11:44, 14 September 2011 (EDT)

I'm gradually moving the generic icon lists to the category page itself, just like it's done for item icons. An example: Category:Acid Effect Icons. I think it's easier to track down generic icon names that way, because you don't have to go to the talk page (one extra click). I'm removing the brackets above to prevent the creation of red links. --Ravanel (talk) 14:18, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

Pages for Deletion

Hiya! Haven't talked to you in a while - hope you've been well. :) If you mark a page for deletion with "wrong name," could you just add which page is the "right" name so I can double check before doing the delete? Thanks! Sethladan 20:41, 22 September 2011 (EDT)

Sure thing, boss~ -- Starbursty (talk) 12:48, 25 September 2011 (EDT)
Hi again! Just wanted to know if you were gonna be cleaning up the links for all those MP pages and icons that you marked for deletion, or if I should expect to be doing that at some point? :) Sethladan 12:56, 13 October 2011 (EDT)
I can do it if you want. I thought maybe you liked deleting links :D -- Starbursty (talk) 12:57, 13 October 2011 (EDT)
Hahah! I do like doing organizational things like that, but I didn't know if you wanted me running after you like a nanny with a vacuum. ;) Sethladan 14:13, 13 October 2011 (EDT)


Hia, I just want so "cheers" and also assure you that I am not stalking you, we just seems to be crossing paths a lot anyway. As you surely have understood I have not done all of the quests I "adjust" but my edits are more of adjusting them to today's layout and scheme. Over the years it seems several layouts have been around, or perhaps just not a set format, so the looks are thereafter. Whatever ... it seems we complement each other quite well :)

I am mainly focusing on geography, but with each location I scan through the quests that links to the locations, either started there or 'involving' ... sometimes I find quests that do not link to the location but should, other times they link but should not, a constant struggle. But overall it is good that we walk through them together I think, in the end of the day, the result cannot be worse -haha-

Feel free to talk at my page if you want to bash at me, or just cheer. Chers -- Zimoon (talk) 12:34, 4 October 2011 (EDT)

Creating new items

Hi Starbursty, as you may have noticed on here, items are going to be getting changed soon. In preparation for this, could you use {{Item Tooltip}} instead of {{Tooltip}} for any items you create over the next few days (then it will change again :P)? Just asking as you seem to create most of our items here :). Amphoras (talkTalk to me!) 20:03, 4 October 2011 (EDT)

Sure thing. -- Starbursty (talk) 20:07, 4 October 2011 (EDT)
BTW, do you recall where you encountered the Item:Twisted Finger Bone? I am curious as the the level of monster that dropped it. RingTailCat (talk) 06:26, 2 January 2012 (EST)
It dropped in the Delving of Frór so about level 75. -- Starbursty (talk) 15:21, 2 January 2012 (EST)

A Mysterious Skill

I noticed Wounding Thrust hiding in the Minstrel Skills category. I'm guessing it was mis-categorized, since no such minstrel skill exists, but I was unable to find it as a skill for any other class either. Do you know where it belongs?

Belated signature: --Elinnea (talk) 21:59, 17 October 2011 (EDT)
I think it might have been in one of the Session Plays, the one with the Balrog. I'll check it. -- Starbursty (talk) 13:21, 18 October 2011 (EDT)
It was from the Session Play for Nafni in The Fall of Moria. I'll put that on my to do list. -- Starbursty (talk) 13:29, 18 October 2011 (EDT)

Creature inspects

We recently introduced a new parameter called "inspector-lvl" on the creature template. There you enter the level of your lore-master, as inspects depend heavily on the level of the LM. Can you please add it to your recent inspect(s) e.g. Nethgarch? Would be great :) --EoD (talk) 17:38, 23 October 2011 (EDT)

Sure thing. I'll do it for the future ones since I've deleted that screenie for Nethgarch. -- Starbursty (talk) 05:51, 24 October 2011 (EDT)
Aww, that's a pity. But nice to hear that you try to do it for the other ones :) --EoD (talk) 07:44, 24 October 2011 (EDT)

Empty lines or not

Hi ho Star, I tried to find out if we had some error in our templates that causes that mis-alignment between the quest-box and the quest info-box. That an empty line between the info-box and the following quest-box makes the two uneven by the top-line, which looks ugly. See this :)

In short, the templates works alright, it is the Wiki-engine that adds a <p><br/></p> when it finds an empty line, and this makes the two boxes uneven. Please remove such empty lines when you find them, and do not add new. The empty line stains the good look for the casual visitor, but they add zero-to-none value to us as editors, right?

At another note, while talking looks and what not. Please do not use === to make lines bold, use '''. Header markup is for creating headers, not for formatting. Yes, the line becomes bold, but it also adds to the TOC, which is why we should not use that in quests unless in the quest text. We need no TOC-lines for quest-chains or selectable rewards ;)

Then, my best of compliments for the great work you do with updating and adding quests. I hope you have lots of fun while doing them. My pottering with geography has made me read LOTR again and this time comparing lore with in-game geography ;) Possibly some lore might be added to some locations, but that will be a later project, a lot later, haha. -- Zimoon (talk) 12:16, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

Thanks! Sounds good. I just finished re-reading The Hobbit today :D -- Starbursty (talk) 18:01, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

Question about Epic Quests

Hi Star, what is your opinion on how we display epic quests on location and NPC pages, as today? Or no extra sub-headers but include volume and book in the displayed link? Examples (somewhat shortened, and from Candaith):
== Involved in Quests ==

Vol. 1, Book 2:

Vol. 1, Book 3:

Vol. 3, Book 1:

== Involved in Quests ==

Epic Quests:

Personally I would prefer the latter which conveys exactly the same information, but is very much less chopped up and it looks "neater" (if that is a good adjective?). How do you think?
-- Zimoon (talk) 08:56, 8 November 2011 (EST)

I think the latter looks better. I started doing the '''Vol. 1, Book 3''' ones because the quests were disorganized back then. Go to town with the latter! Maybe a separate section for Starting, Involving, and Epic (3 in all). -- Starbursty (talk) 12:49, 8 November 2011 (EST)
Cool, I will keep an eye at how you do to keep in sync. You are updating loads of quests, NPCs, and locations so I follow you ;)
For some locations with lengthier lists I have begun to use transclude from the location-quests category. If it exists. And if it is fairly complete, far from all quests are locally categorized and I do not know what will happen with my suggestion over at test-wiki, if anything. Still need to type lists but then at the category page, and it is usually transcluded both to location and to area, so at least one less page to update all the time :D
-- Zimoon (talk) 16:33, 8 November 2011 (EST)
The later scheme looks good for locations. I am not sure that a heading for Epic quests needs to be listed separately, since the names are very distinctive, and we would really need two epic headings, one for start and one for involves.
NPCs are another matter. Where we have NPCs who appear in different regions, and seems to be subject to different phasing, I think we need to have regional headings. For someone like Halbarad, all the North Downs quests needs to be grouped separately from the Rivendell/Eregion/Enedwaith quests and separate from the Dunland quests. Likewise, Nona, who appears at several different places as you progress through Enedwaith and also in Dunland. It seems to me that the phasing of this NPC is independent in Enedwaith and in Dunland, so the quests she is involved with from those two areas should not be mixed together. I know you get the Item:Map of Dunland without completing the Enedwaith epic line. RingTailCat (talk) 17:12, 8 November 2011 (EST)
I agree, the less "cluttery" the better, without giving up facts. Yes, I likes the Halbarad changes, it became crisp and clear and related nicely in location and time. Geez, what a task to merge all of that (Zimoon runs hiding somewhere) --Zimoon (talk) 18:07, 8 November 2011 (EST)
Cheers mates (adding a link to here at RTC's page too).
The recent days I tried a different scheme for quests on some NPCs. Not sure if you noticed, Halbarad is such an example. All those bolded "header lines" chopping up the list of quests has disturbed me a bit, and the issue became more apparent when merging different-locations to same NPC page because the 3:rd header level (===) for quests and the Epic line kind of jumps at the reader, and some of them had just one or two quests per book.
My suggestion, if "approved" is to only have bolded headers at "Volume" level, such as Volume III Epic Quests:, and italic rather than bold if there is an "interfering" 3:rd-level header line. Then including e.g. "Book 12, " in the visible part of the quest link/name, just before the current "Chapter..." part. It seems pretty neat I think, without being overly cluttery, a user must almost be blind not to realize what this is all about.
What if an NPC has just one Epic quest? Not sure to be honest, probably the neatest way is to add a trailing " - Epic" but you may have better ideas. In fact, I am not so sure we always have to spell out all nit-picky details at the NPC pages, perhaps the quest level, name, and as brief as possible extra info is sufficient for NPCs, and the quest that is linked to provides the rest. Sometimes being over-detailed is more distracting, but that is indeed a mine field of personal judgements and also is a from-case-to-case issue, probably being flexible is best, right?
Zimoon (talk) 06:49, 9 December 2011 (EST)
I saw that as I was doing and cleaning some of the pre-Dunland quests and NPCs. I think that looks fine. I created new pages for the Rangers when they first start at Dunland. I think the code {{other|Halbarad in Dunland|the unified page|Halbarad}} is a good way to clear up the {{Other|}}. It makes it look cleaner rather having 4+ links to different places of the same NPC. If you manage to finish the one for Halbarad, I suppose we will still do the separate pages for NPCs in different region/places (a la Braigiar (Dunland)) but have a unified page for the singular original NPC. That is a mighty task, Zimoon! -- Starbursty (talk) 07:40, 9 December 2011 (EST)
Question: You mean you still want to have different pages for same NPC, one per location, and one unified? Or you mean it is a mighty task to unify them? Zimoon (talk) 11:16, 9 December 2011 (EST)
It is a task to unify. Granted, there aren't that many NPCs that have multiple pages other than the Rangers and the main characters. -- Starbursty (talk) 18:40, 10 December 2011 (EST)

Monster Play (Creep) quest

I have been thinking about the way we refer to quests in the Creep section of Monster Play.

Creep quests are always at the current highest level. When the level cap is raised, from 50 to 60 to 65 to 75, all the quest referencing pages, as well as the quest pages themselves need to be edited to change the level number.

With that in mind, I am inclined to suggest that we omit the level number when we reference quests in the Ettenmoors. This will reduce the number of pages needing updates to just the quest pages themselves next time the level cap is raised.

I am not so familiar with the Freep side, but it seems like this might also be applicable to all but the

quest that vectors you to the moors.

Uploading double icons

Regarding File:Greater Token of Fire-icon.png with 60(!) binary identical files.
First, it is not the goal on the wiki to upload all icons with their wiki-name. It is sufficient to have one unique icon (doesn't matter what the name is), which is used on all appropriate pages. The name of an icon doesn't matter to visitors and users, as long as the appearance of it is correct. Uploading icons that are identical to already existing icons is very counterproductive. Let me explain the current situation:

  1. You have a huge collection of generic icons on your pc.
  2. You upload those generic icons 60 times on the wiki with a different name.
  3. Other wiki-editors have to manually change all the links on 60 pages and delete 59 icons so they can all be used by 1 generic icon.

Now how it could also have been:

  1. You upload 1 icon on the wiki.
  2. You use the name of that icon for 60 item pages.

See the difference? Perhaps your current method is somehow a tiny bit faster or easier to you, but it is counterproductive in the end. The small amount of time that it might spare you is nullified by the hours of extra work it costs other contributors to clean up the mess. Hours tidying up the wiki that could have been spent doing something useful instead.
It sincerely think it is great that you spend so much time with icons on this wiki, but I think you would make me and quite some other editors very happy if you restrain from uploading all the identical double ones. I hope you understand. --Ravanel (talk) 08:09, 12 December 2011 (EST)

There was no icon to refer to unlike the others like Rings or Light Armour. Do you want me to make a page for the icon? You sound exasperated :D -- Starbursty (talk) 08:13, 12 December 2011 (EST)
That was not what I meant. I'm trying to explain to you that the goal is to have 1 icon that looks like that flag on this wiki, and not 60. It does not really matter what that 1 icon is called. It is not a problem if there is no generic icon yet. We would just rather not have you upload any duplicates, because if you don't, it saves us a lot of work. If you need to use an icon on a page, you can use the name of an already existing icon with the same appearance for the time being, even if it does not have a generic name. You are of course also allowed to rename that one into a generic name, if you want to do it perfect. But if you don't feel like that, that's OK as well.
You are an experienced editor by now, so it would be great if you could paste already existing icon names for new item pages instead of uploading the same file over and over. I hope it is more clear now. : ) --Ravanel (talk) 08:28, 12 December 2011 (EST)
Hehe! I was looking up the User talk to say you could have just followed this one editor's suggestion and told me to just use a generic icon. Then I noticed it was you! on Generic Icons for Effects -- Starbursty (talk) 08:33, 12 December 2011 (EST)
Yup, that was me as well. Using generic icons is the best. But if they don't exist yet, it's better to use an already existing icon with random name than to upload a new one. --Ravanel (talk) 09:12, 12 December 2011 (EST)

Hat of the Woundcloser

When this item dropped for me, it was only usable for characters of level 75, just like all the skirmish teal loot gear. Has anything changed? (Regarding [2].) --Ravanel (talk) 07:42, 15 December 2011 (EST)

They changed the dual Tactical to Tactical Mastery. (Update 5, Armies of Isengard) In dozens of instances that I have seen it drop, I didn't see a minimum level. I am sure that there are mixed raid drops with minimum 75 and no minimum. Maybe the "Minimum Level 75" only shows up when you see it as a player below 75? I've already deleted the screenie so I don't remember if I saw it as 75 or if I saw it as below that level. -- Starbursty (talk) 08:00, 16 December 2011 (EST)
Found another screenie with the level 75 on it (from the view of a 75). So I guess it shows with or without. I'd say to just put the number 75 in. It seems like that way if seen by a 75. Maybe I saw this same item below 75 then. -- Starbursty (talk) 16:56, 26 December 2011 (EST)

Category Tale quests

See User_talk:Zimoon#Category:Tale_Quests_130

Class Quests ...

Hi Star,

Regarding Quest:An Eye in the Storm. Why I removed Rune-keeper from questgroup was that it doubled the info the info-box (both group and class reading the same). Both of them adds to the proper category. There is one difference though, the links: the group links refers to the category while the class link refers to the class page. So, to be honest I do not know what is best when it comes to the links as such, but having two superficially identical entries does not look great either. And the link to the category is always found at the bottom of the page anyway, would somebody want to use it.

Personally I think information should be clear and intuitive. Two entries is confusing. The link "Class: ..." instantly tells a restriction and group in the same go. Group does not tell a restriction but a category, such as some of those crafting quests that anybody can do by either buying the item or having a nice crafting friend.

What are your thoughts on this topic? Zimoon (talk) 19:37, 27 January 2012 (EST)

I looked over them. The link to the category is at the bottom and I think there shouldn't be any confusion. One thing I had in mind lately was what to do with the linking of the class category page. In the later class trainers, they do not seem to offer those class quests that were available to lower level class trainers. It doesn't seem to be possible to /onlyinclude different parts of a page. I think a good way is to link the page for the Rune-keeper class within the Walkthrough & Notes part so at least it is linked to the Rune-keeper page and shows up on the "What links here". Yes, I think it is a good idea to get rid of that Class category in the quest box since linking the Rune-keeper page from within the "Quest:An Eye in the Storm" accomplishes the same thing. -- Starbursty (talk) 20:40, 30 January 2012 (EST)
I tried to announce on your page that I responded but it kept hanging. -- Starbursty (talk) 21:16, 30 January 2012 (EST)
Hmm, now I have added my e-mail address (again) so I hope it does not hang again. I remember RTC had this problem the other week and that Lotroadmin mentioned this as a cause. A bug in the liquid threads I gathered.
Questgroup versus class: both adds to category and thus adds a link-to-category at the bottom of the page, but then they differ. Within the info-box (where most people will look) the Quest Group will link to the category page (e.g. Category:Rune-keeper Quests) while Class will link to the class page (e.g. Rune-keeper). I reapplied both to the Rune-keeper quest that started this topic so you can compare.
OK, that was another take, linking to class from within the walk-through. Which link-style is the better depends on what I want to know, first off the class pages are of different quality, and quest categories may be the best place for quest info, whether transcluded or not. ... I did not know that higher level trainers (if that is what you meant?) do not offer lower level quests -- this means that questgiver cannot really be "any class trainer" as we have used to tell. On the other hand I don't think it matters, low-level characters won't notice, but if lower-level trainers do not offer higher-level quests we need to re-think.
I am not very happy to move commonly used links into the walk-through, yet another click-through. But if not common it is another think. Perhaps it is best to use both questgroup and class after all? Gee what everything may be complicated 8-)
It is possible to transclude different parts, but it is not that easy. And it is a lot of duplications at the page to transclude from as it is not possible (at least I failed) to pick and chose to puzzle together what is wanted. Thus there must be one section for transclude-style A, and for B, one for C, and if they partially share something it must be duplicated, but I do not recall right now where and who had it on his sandbox-pages :(
Zimoon (talk) 02:12, 31 January 2012 (EST)

Quest topic at...

RTC:Quests .. Epic / Other
Zimoon (talk) 13:44, 2 February 2012 (EST)

You edit of Template:Item Tooltip

I noticed you edited Template:Item Tooltip. But you forgot to read the Template talk:Item Tooltip#Next Edit and include the suggested items. Please consider Lotroadmin's suggestion to keep the edits of this template to a minimum and rather add to the "next edit" section, OR incorporate existing suggestions in the same edit.

Now all of those suggestions are still pending, as well as the site struggles with an 20k job queue. The latter was why I had a look at the recent changes, so Lotroadmin's suggestion is not too rash I guess ;)
-- Zimoon (talk) 11:54, 25 August 2012 (EDT)

I've read the link. It was my fault for not knowing there was that topic! I'll refrain from editing the templates and I'll just be updating what exists :D -- Starbursty (talk) 20:44, 26 August 2012 (EDT)
How ya been, btw? -- Starbursty (talk) 21:12, 26 August 2012 (EDT)
I'm fine, how about you? I have missed you during the summer, good to see you back again :) -- Zimoon (talk) 02:32, 27 August 2012 (EDT)
I wasn't here much during summer. Looks like I missed quite a bit of action! -- Starbursty (talk) 07:41, 27 August 2012 (EDT)

Purchased from store

I gather you recently added the "purchased from store" parameter to the Item Tooltip.

That description is not reliable. Many items can be purchased from the store - in which case they will have that description; however, the exact same items can be obtained from many other sources and they do NOT have that description. Even supposed "Store Exclusives" wind up as "Lottery Prizes," and do not have that tag. (I've gotten 3 different supposedly exclusive store mounts that way.)

Or, put another way, while it is possible to have an item in your inventory showing "purchased from store" -- it will not necessarily look that way to another user.
Wm Magill - Valamar - OTG/OTC (talk) 12:26, 25 August 2012 (EDT)

I've encountered several items with that parameter, but I have already deleted the screen captures. If you want to, you can edit that out of the Item Tooltip and I'll just ignore future items with the line "Purchased from store." -- Starbursty (talk) 20:40, 26 August 2012 (EDT)


Hello Starbursty, I was hoping you can send me a private message with your email. --Lotroadmin (talk) 03:05, 23 November 2013 (UTC)

I can't figure out how to send a private message. haha-- Starbursty (talk) 13:59, 27 November 2013 (UTC)
heh, i missed this one.. just go to my talk page and look in the sidebar under tools where it says email this user. You might have to punch an an email address for your account preferences. --Lotroadmin (talk) 05:48, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Ohh, I'd been wondering this too. I can confirm that you need to have an email set in your own account to be able to send an email to somebody else who has enabled the option. -- Elinnea (talk) 15:27, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Moria Creatures

I see you have been adding the area parameter for several Moria creatures - awesome! Appreciate your edits! If when doing so you would also change the location parameter (region) value to Moria that would hit two birds with one stone so to speak ;) --Savi (talk) 16:05, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

Should the "Region" be changed to Moria or the "Area" be changed to Moria? I wasn't quite sure which should be which on this new parameter. Starbursty (talk) 16:08, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
Region is Moria...unless they are creatures inside a skirmish or instance then the region is Skirmish or Instance. Area is the specific location like the forgotten treasury or the great delving, etc
Ok. Thanks for the heads up! Starbursty (talk) 16:20, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
Certainly, thanks for the edits! Also, just an fyi, the categories for creatures still have a ways to go before they are correctly organized so don't let that throw you --Savi (talk) 16:22, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
The location parameter for creatures inside an instance, say Chieftain Gûrsh, automatically filters to Category:The Library at Tham Mírdain Mobs which is a sub-directory of Category:Eregion Creatures. With Moria Archer (The Sixteenth Hall), I see you've changed the location parameter to Instance. In this case, it's filtered to Category:Instance Mobs which is not yet a sub-directory nor page. If using the previous function of the location parameter in the Creature Page, placing "The Sixteenth Hall" in the location parameter, Moria Archer (The Sixteenth Hall) would filter to Category:The Sixteenth Hall Mobs which is a sub-directory of Category:Nud-melek Creatures. Would you suggest using "Instance" in the location parameter of the Creature Page (shows up as Region) or keep using the location parameter and have it filter to its corresponding Category normally? Starbursty (talk) 16:46, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
You give a perfect example of the mess of categories from this template! The template is auto generating both of the categories (one of which hasn't been saved as a page and one of which has). Eventually I hope to get everything straightened out so red categories can't just pop into existence but until that time...Imo, the chief really should show as an Instance location with the Library link as its area. Since doing so cuts the previous auto category you could add at the bottom of the page a manual Category:The Library at Tham Mírdain Mobs(simply remove the : when pasting there). That way its still categorized until everything is finished and its also easy to find that way as well. --Savi (talk) 17:00, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
Ok, so explain what you want the location parameter to do, exactly (and the area parameter, too). I didn't think think it was a problem until I saw the new area parameter on the creature pages which doesn't seem to be doing anything at the moment :D Starbursty (talk) 17:30, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
The location parameter is working property, just will be adding a category to auto pop for those with the value of Instance (Other locations already correctly auto category, unless they are not one of the switch cases, which is when they auto populate a category based on whatever value is entered, this will be removed later but I can't just take it out now or the pages using it...basically go boom, lol, lots of data loss) The area parameter is a specified location. Currently the moria zones are the only auto categories linked with it, but I am still brainstorming on if more will be added later (need to look into any negative factors if any when switch cases get too large on a template, etc). And both of those parameters do show up in the sidebar (as links) as well. Not sure if that explained your question? The creature template is my current project. The visuals got changed, now I just need to iron out its other features --Savi (talk) 19:35, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
Ok, I will leave the creature pages for the moment until the changes are done so it can be changed wholesale. Starbursty (talk) 11:36, 24 January 2014 (UTC)
Whatever you prefer. The Instance creature category is now all set up. The other specific ones are not but if added later will do so automatically anyhow ;) --Savi (talk) 14:51, 24 January 2014 (UTC)
Just a quick update on this fyi - the creature template now will auto categorize specific skirmishes when the correct link is used for the area parameter (See the collapsed table "Area" on Template:Creature/doc for correct values) The links aren't the prettiest wording but will at least direct the reader to the skirmish information rather than deed information --Savi (talk) 15:20, 6 February 2014 (UTC)
Alright! Starbursty (talk) 15:32, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Empty redirects?

Ran across 2 redirects you recently created that do not have an actual page yet Dorr-shatroful & Gris-shatroful. Is there a reason you created a redirect before creating the relevant page first? --Savi (talk) 15:21, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Yes. I'll get to those screenshots eventually! Also, the plain alphabet name pages always need to be made to redirect to the pages with the UTF-8 characters. Starbursty (talk) 15:35, 24 February 2014 (UTC)
Totally understand the need for the redirects, just figured the actual page came first so wanted to double check. Glad to hear its still on your agenda, and entirely get how to-do lists always exceed the time available ^_^ Happy editing! --Savi (talk) 15:45, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

What to do with this new user

You've been doing this linger than I have -- What to do about -- recent contributions by user Oo?

I don't know if he/she is just testing us or simply a 12-year old wise-ass.
I was about to create the User page, and fix the others when I found the changes on the Gondor page "Poopy Gondor was builded by Poópy The Fart of Númenor."
And the most recent page created: User:
Wm Magill - Valamar - OTG/OTC - talk 15:08, 1 March 2014 (UTC)
Testing, it seems. I am continually watching the contribs. Starbursty (talk) 02:55, 2 March 2014 (UTC)
Also, vandals seem to be posting at about 9am to 3pm London time. Some of the previous links are definitely European. Starbursty (talk) 03:03, 2 March 2014 (UTC)


Heya Star - Been weeding out some of the requested categories that shouldn't be there, and came across Dunlending Archer-captain which you recently created. Please put the Region in the location field (West Rohan in this case) rather than a specific zone (that is what the area parameter is for). Doing so will also add the auto region categories, Category:West Rohan Creatures for this mob. Thanks! --Savi (talk) 20:54, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Oops! That was my fault. I've been putting in location=West Rohan and area=region for the newer pages. Must've copied and pasted that from an early version. Starbursty (talk) 11:38, 14 March 2014 (UTC)

Missing Warden icons

Hi Starbursty, I recently brought the Warden pages up to date with U12/13. I noticed that you had done a lot of work towards creating the new skill, trait, etc. pages. Thank you very much - that made the job easier. However, after finishing the work I found there were some that had slipped through the cracks - for example, ranged gambit alternatives like Ranged Persevere and the Shield Mastery (Trait) that had been confused with the similar Skill. I was wondering if you had a process for extracting the icon images from the database, or if you were just clipping them from screenshots. I can do the work to fill in the gaps, but I didn't want to go through everything manually if there were actually some automated processes to generate the images and text. Thanks. --Calico (talk) 05:36, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Hiya! Yeah, I do them all manually. I use GIMP image editor for the screenshots. I used to use MS Paint, but the colors were washed when I saved them so I moved to GIMP. There's no automated process for the text, unfortunately. -- Starbursty (talk) 10:46, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Full Powers

It's way overdue,for that i'm sorry,but you have full POWERS!!! you can hide at will :) --Lotroadmin (talk) 06:14, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! You know I don't use my powers that much, hehe-- Starbursty (talk) 15:26, 29 June 2014 (UTC)