Talk:Nazgûl (Bree)

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Is it possible for a Lore-master to read the stats of this creature?
I think it was just there for the drama, not attackable. If that is the case I suggest we delete this page and live with Nazgûl as a place-holder for them all in non-attackable place.

Should any one of them appear as attackable somewhere we should create separate pages for that event, or at least if the stats are not close enough for sharing a page. Or is there a better way to convey the information?
-- Zimoon (talk) 12:14, 12 September 2012 (EDT)

As far as I know, it isn't possible to scan them, as they have to enter combat for the Scan skill to be used on them. The only thing they do in that instance is deliver some dialogue and run off, much as with their other early appearances. That being the case, they're basically NPCs, and could be documented as such. This page could be converted to an NPC page in that case, or deleted in favor of a single comprehensive one (similar to how we've been doing Rangers, IE Candaith or Golodir.)
The Nazgûl page uses stats for the encounter in the Volume I, Book 5 instance, which is the only combat encounter with a Nazgul until the Lieutenant in Mirkwood. There's another brief encounter or two in Volume III and Rohan, each a highly scripted fight with NPC support, which would still only make them Combat NPCs I think. That said, it might be a good idea to split off the level 43 encounter as its own page and have Nazgul focused more on the lore and story appearances, similar to how we have Saruman (for the character) and Saruman (The Tower of Orthanc) (for the combat stats of that appearance). Besides, there's nine different Nazgul, and some have their own names. -- JnK (talk) 12:49, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
I agree - for another non-combat Nazgûl encounter I created an NPC page: Fell-rider Nazgûl. The only issue was that I had to manually add it to the Wraiths category.
I always thought it was a little strange that the combat information for one level 43 Nazgûl topped the page that is really about all the appearances of Nazgûl in the game. I would rather port the Helegrod rider and his stats off to his own page, and let the generic Nazgûl page be a sort of index, with the lore about who the Nazgûl are, and links to the individual pages, like it has now. I like giving each one its own page, since some are in combat and some are not, and some will use different effects or require different tactics. They keep having different names in different encounters, and yet they are all Nazgûl. I'm sure we're going to keep running into these guys as the game progresses. -- Elinnea (talk) 13:11, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
Perhaps we would better turn the Nazgûl page into a plain page. They are not really NPCs either though they are closer to NPCs than mobs. But I think what we would like to emphasize is what they are and what they do and where they appear in some chronological order, right? We do not need any template for that. Or, we could used the creature template but with the parameter "noharm=yes" which removes all combat stats. The problem with all our templates is they always do some magic and in a case like this, the odd balls, they are not really perfect.
And I interpret your responses such as when we need a combat page we simply create creature pages per level and/or location where combat takes place. Also, they are nine, a shrinking number, but they are nine distinct individuals, if that matters for those extra pages?
-- Zimoon (talk) 15:50, 12 September 2012 (EDT)
I rather like the idea of using the noharm parameter for the drama-only appearances; I forgot that had been added. Since it uses the creature template, it signals to me that this character is an Enemy, which is of course true, even if I can't attack or inspect all his stats. But yeah, I think the important things on the Nazgûl page itself is to say what a Nazgûl is and list their appearances in the game.
It's true that there are only nine of them, but as far as I know, the game doesn't indicate which one of the nine is in front of you, except when it's the Witchking of Angmar or the Lieutenant of Dol Guldur. I could very well be missing important clues, though... -- Elinnea (talk) 09:45, 14 September 2012 (EDT)
It's rare that they distinguish - even in the lore, only the Witchking and the Lt. were differentiated. In game, there are Black Riders and Nazgul and Fell-rider Nazgul, which are all basically different names for the same homogenous band of characters. However, there were a few more names established in Mirkwood, such as The Gloom of Nurn and The Black Blade of Lebennin. With the Nazgul playing a more prominent role in Rohan, this is probably a good time to clean up and reorganize these pages. -- JnK (talk) 11:04, 14 September 2012 (EDT)