Talk:Lore-master

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Lore-master

  • The Lore-master's "Test of Will" skill now has accompanying sound.
  • Lore-master pets have returned from temperament training and will no longer cause an auditory ruckus when summoned.
  • Storm-Lore now has a new icon.
  • A sound will now play to indicate that a Lore-master's pet has flanked an enemy.
  • The sound for the Lore-master's “Knowledge of the Lore-master” skill has been replaced. --Fedaykin 07:26, 16 February 2008 (PST)

To Do

Some skills still using old icons (Blinding Flash, Share the Power, Ancient Wisdom, SOP:R) Non-combat pets summoning skills (animal-speech) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by MysterX (Contribs • Message).

All old icons have been taken care of in the course of 2010. --Ravanel 13:00, 21 May 2011 (EDT)

Skill Stats Errors

It appears that many of the skill statistics were collected by a higher level lore-master who had traits slotted and/or legendary items equipped. This reduced the morale and power costs displayed in the tool tips.

I think the skill tables should display the unmodified skill costs. The costs with traits and legendary items will vary depending on the players current configuration, but the base costs should be the same for everyone.

Perhaps we need a level 65 player to unslot all traits and equipment and capture the naked truth about the skill costs. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by RingTailCat (Contribs • Message).

Not 100% sure what you mean, but the power/morale cost for the skills on this page should reflect the cost at the level you get the skill for the first time. I think some of them have been taken at level 65. They naturally shouldn't be taken by Lore-masters with Tactically Adept and/or Harmony with Nature traited. There are no legacies for Lore-masters that reduce the power or morale costs of skills.
I'm working on updating the individual Lore-master skill pages myself at the moment and came as far as Cracked Earth, going from top to bottom. The power costs of these skills on the Lore-master Skills page will all be fixed when I finish this project. The power costs are found on the Lorebook and seem to be correct; the morale cost is nowhere to be found though, and will have to be recorded by an on-level Lore-master. Since my own Lore-master is level 65, I won't be able to do this. --Ravanel 12:46, 21 May 2011 (EDT)
I have a spreadsheet of the skills open on my second monitor. I copied the active skills list off the LM page, and cleared the morale and power cost columns, so I have to fill them in as I learn them. I also added an induction column because that seemed to be important for me, and a cooldown column.
I'm running solo on Dwarrowdelf because my wife is playing with her kinnies on Vilya all the time now. My LM just reached level 22 today. I haven't been playing the LM for several months. I am a keyboard oriented player, and the LM is a pain to play because F10 to select a corpse often selects my pet. RingTailCat 17:44, 21 May 2011 (EDT)
Great to hear you're solving that problem there! :D About the inductions and cooldowns, not sure if it's a great idea to add these to the Lore-master Skills page, since these things aren't on the other classes' skill tables either (consistency is nice) and they might get a bit long. Think it's better to put that info just on the individual skill pages. Writing them down can surely be a good way though to get to know your Lore-master well and see which skills are best power/damage efficient etc. :) --Ravanel 14:17, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

Role

Telling that LM is master of CC as a primary role, even if true, isn't quite accurate nor useful
for new player who are more alike to look for wiki info when looking for help for a class.
I would suggest that Role section to be more precise in the role they will be more oftenly asked by fellows.


The Lore-master role is unique and consist at ensuring his allies to fill their own roles, specially the tank and healer, while preventing enemies to fill theirs. The Lore-master got many skills with no equivalance in other classes:

His role stand around using those skills:

  • Remove diseases from the Tank.
(check the option: "enable skill target forwarding" to allow you to do that and Dpsing without changing target.)
  • Remove silence on healer with Sign of Power: Righteousness and keep that buff on Tank in fight where there is stun, knockdown, knock-out effect.
  • Keep the power of Tank and Healer at more then 50% and keep draining power with Power of Knowledge.

The Lore-Master must also:

  • Heal the Healer and CC mobs that are on him.
  • Heal the tank if he drop below 30%

For the rest Gust of Wind is a much powerful tool which reduce enemies chance to hit your allies as doing AoE damage, over Cracked Earth which CC effect can (and IS most of the time) breaked by damages.

Then I woukld come with specification of each classes trait set orientation of role.
  • Keeper of Animal Can be define as half-healing, half-tanking specialist.
  • Master of Nature's Fury focus on Dps principaly AoE, giving up a little on the CC role.
  • Ancient Master

The ancient master is the undisputed master of crowd-control: the ability to stun, daze and root creatures, thus keeping them from hurting his allies. He also possesses a wide and varied arsenal of skills that weaken and impede enemies, causing their strength to wane, their strikes to miss, and their actions to slow.

And after with Mandatory talents, if any.

There are traits that are considered mandatory by almost all LM to fulfil there role:

Finally I would like to include a link to a Spec page with many specs in it.

Jeanperson (talk) 16:41, 17 September 2011 (EDT)

I see some good points. Sign of Power:Righteousness and and sharing/pulling power as skill unique to the Lore-master would be nice to include on the page. However, this page is meant as a general (and short) introduction to the class. The more extended tips you provide would suit on a class guide. We have plans for these, but they haven't been realized just yet. I am first busy with updating all Lore-master skill pages and was planning to continue with that after those are done. We might want to wait for the changes of RoI before writing it down too, since some things will change (especially the Keeper of Animal trait line).
I do not agree on all you wrote (although I don't want to go into a discussion now); there is more to a Lore-master than healing, power, stundots and removing diseases on tanks. What about the most important addition of the Lore-master to groups: their debuffs! Fire-lore! Sign of Power: See All Ends! Ancient Craft! These are the real reasons people take Lore-masters in their raids, and they trait Ancient Master to be able to keep these debuffs up 100% of the time.
Nevertheless, the things you wrote down could all be added to a Lore-master class guide at the Wiki. They give some good things to start with. Thanks for thinking along and sharing your thoughts. :) --Ravanel (talk) 19:19, 17 September 2011 (EDT)

well...I dunno if I should answer back since you don't wanna make a discussion over it for now, but just mentionning that I was more focussing on below lvl 30 abilities considering beyond that more about a advanced topic. As for the Lores I simply assumed that those were obviously useful, My main Concern was to clearly tell any Newbies that would look into wiki what that class will be asked to do from lvl 20, not tell them what they gonna have to do once 65 in raid. I saw so LM failing to do those things that are vital in GB and GA, seeing that here was said that LM is a CC, problem is... most player trying to Mez a target in their first GB will just notice that nobody even pay attention and will eventually stop trying it; I'm not saying that it's not the role of LM, just saying that the general information about the game should more accuratly tell the newcoming player what they will be asked to do if they start that class, actually the Role section might be split into 2 subsection with the other for advanced role.

Still I never saw someone flame a LM for failing to Mez a mob but failing to give power to a healer that's fail, mot removing disease on tank is fail, not healing healer is fail, not removing silence on healer is fail. getting a Tank knocked off the stairs in GS or getting the tank stun/daze in thadur because the LM just didn't knew SoP:R, is a fail.

Even If there is more to the role of LM, what I agree, the LM role is one of the biggest in lotro he got to take care of so many things, but there is some basic, beside not all player of lotro gonna end into Raid play, and not all player gonna reach cap lvl but all player gonna do 6 man or 3 man instances. So eadgame might be more accuratly classified as an advanced topic, no? SoP:SAE is a lvl 58 skill, I've not even mentionned SoP:C cause telling a LM to keep it on every single mob might become tedious, of course in boss fight this is a must but, Hey! I tried to stay on basic, that's why I mentionned GoW a 7% miss chance AoE damage is something more easy to ask for beginners.

well I should stop that since we are not suppose to discusse it right now. At least then can I add a link for "Beginner (class) Role Guide" or "tips" at the buttom of Role sectionof each classe? example Beginner Lore-Master Role Tips?

Where I might start devellope those infos. the classes I'm planning to write about at first are RK, Cappy, LM, Champion.

Jeanperson (talk) 10:10, 18 September 2011 (EDT)

The Lore-master page is supposed to give an idea about the class as it is complete. Mind you, it is also nice to know as a beginning player what to expect when you're at end game level, what sort of class you're going to play when you are done leveling. Based on that people will pick the class that fits them best.
A Lore-master Guide is still in the making. I was planning to get to that when I'm done with getting all Lore-master Skills up to date (I am nearing my goal, although I'll have to update some skills with RoI). The page should be called Guide to the Lore-master and be set up as a guide to the class as a whole. Guide to the Burglar is a good example of what it could look like.
If I look at what you wanted to write though, it seems like this mostly covers the beginning levels, and then only the grouping as in the Great Barrow and Garth Agarwen. You don't mention anything about removing wounds in a group, which could also be useful (and you get the skill at level 10), but I think that is because you were aiming to cover those specific instances. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) In order to create the right picture, it would be best if you would clearly tell so in your text.
Where to do this? Perhaps Guide to the Beginning Lore-master would be a good place to start with. We can always change the name later if required. I'll ask fellow contributors for advice. We can link from the Lore-master page to your guide. We could also link from the specific instance pages to your guide for class-specific advice/directions.
You'll have to structure what you wrote a bit better of course. Seeing the vast amount of Lore-masters that just throw Burning Embers and don't do anything else, I would also strongly suggest to at least write something about the importance of Fire-lore and SoP:Command. Many don't have any idea what it does and how useful this is. It is also worth keeping in mind that with RoI, Blinding Flash will be useful on the Undead.
You could create similar pages for the other classes. Hope to have been of help. --Ravanel (talk) 06:37, 19 September 2011 (EDT)

Well My intent was to mention remove wound isn't removable in combat unless you equip a trait then I thought to mention it more into the different specialised role section.

Off course there is sadly other instance for low level and fornost group are quite rare(with good reason). Still I started at low lvl thus below 40 and intented to make an advanced section for higher lvl 40+, pretty much splitting lvl range in two at the point where legendary trait come into play. SO between those 2 sections would have be a section about trait and proper spec.

Then about RoI i just didn't gave any head to that but since it should be released this fall I might wait a little to see what change will come cause I must admit that after many testing about many KoA spec I find quite ackward, bonus trait set give no healing help mostly buff pet and only 4 traits from it can be considered as truely "healing" trait, KoA always seamed to me more about off tanking trait line more then healer, a healer would rater go 4 trait into ancient master and 3 into KoA or MoNF, with The Study of Wind-lore, The Study of Fire-lore, Deep Lore and Improved Sign of Power: Command with Proof against All Ills, Healer (Trait) & Light of Hope or Harmony with Nature, Awareness of Body & Knowledge of the Past. As for Blinding flash it become almost useless for MoNF spec, what is strange is that most LM I see are MoNF speced and keep spamming BF. As for SoP:C I was about to mention it still I thought I add to make choice since It was intented at first to be just a Role's section addition, of course If I do a whole page about Tips & Specs then I would cover it all, my intent being about 4 stages: lvl 21 (3 class traits), 33 (with 4 class traits), at 41 (with 5 class traits and a legendary trait) and then lvl58 at wich time you can have unlocked your 5th-set traits bonus legendary trait (thus 7 class traits and 2 legendaries).

That with different style of spec and progression. Still right now I'm kinda a little busy RL this winter I'll have plenty of time and RoI should be released so I'll work on it by then.

Jeanperson (talk) 15:30, 19 September 2011 (EDT)

Might be a good idea to wait how RoI turns out indeed, otherwise you'll have to do some things over again. We'll be able to remove wounds in combat etc. I agree on that KoA is not a real healer line and probably never will be, although it gets buffed (User:Ravanel/Sandbox, see traits) with RoI. I see it more like a solo line, nice to kill really hard stuff on your LM all alone. :) --Ravanel (talk) 17:32, 19 September 2011 (EDT)

Trait line summaries

I added a brief summary of each trait line and the color of the line, as this is how they are commonly referred to. I used RoR dev diaries and the lorebook trait set information to craft the summaries. Even so, KoA is a bit cumbersome. If you have a more succinct idea, feel free to replace it. Sweetmint (talk) 19:48, 9 April 2013 (EDT)

Hey, this is somewhat of a necro, since I only noticed this message now (oops). But those summaries look awesome! Made some small changes to the sentences, but nothing big. I think you aptly avoided KoA's cumbersomeness. ^^ --Ravanel (talk) 18:49, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Page errata

Not sure if i'm putting this info at the right place but as a LM player i received the skill "Improved Sign of Power: Command" at level 66 recently, not at level 58 as mentionned on this page. If anyone can double check that would be nice. Thanks ! :) - Drexlorn

Hey Drexlorn, thanks for pointing that out! As the individual skill article does have the correct level stated, it's probably just an oversight (probably my mistake, I must've forgotten to update it here as well). I think it used to be bestowed at level 58, but that was a long time ago. If you notice other mistakes like this, feel free to change it on the page yourself. As my own lore-master is already level 115, it's impossible for me to check. :) --Ravanel (talk) 18:32, 20 September 2017 (UTC)
Thanks ! And i placed the skill in the right level order in the LM skills page at Lore-master Skills --Drexlorn
Whoops, forgot about that. See, you're doing a much better job than me already. :) --Ravanel (talk) 19:25, 21 September 2017 (UTC)